#486890
eriknben10 wrote:They can only report those that are legally registered and paying. What about the ones not reporting or paying? How many billions does SS say those they consider illegal but paying into the system suck out of the system in other ways? You can't focus on one of the many costs of illegals and come to the conclusion that it will hurt our economic system to rid it of illegals.


When I said "that's fair" I meant the first part. I still see the negative impacts to the economy.
#486892
what some of us are failing to recognize it that you don't get to decide if it hurts or helps the economy. That is a mute point. If you are here illegally, you must go, it's the law regardless of how it will impact the economy. You don't get to make exceptions to the law based on the premise that it's for the greater good of society. If you are here illegally you don't get an opinion, you don't get to stay because you are nice, or smart, or creative or shrewd or hard working. You don't get to stay because "that's not who we are as a people" whatever the F that means. You could however convince a majority of actual American legislators to consider your position and have them change the law. Otherwise, you get to follow the established process to be naturalized or you get to leave.

As far as the asinine free market comment, free markets must operate within the confines of the law. A prerequisite to Capitalism and free markets within is LAW AND ORDER! Without a civil society, free markets are impossible.
#486899
You were doing so well and then you just couldn't help yourself and made the "assinine" comment. So, let's deal with that first. My argument was based on the idea that immigration policy is related to trade policy. For instance, in Europe, for better or worse, people were allowed to move within the Eurozone. Under NAFTA, movement is restricted to a professional class and requires annual visas that can be renewed indefinitely. Keeps the riff-raff out and allows companies to transfer plant and high-valued employees while keeping common labor trapped.

But my primary reason for making the capitalist comment is that I know through previous conversations that certain posters are in favor of Trump's tariffs and tearing up trade agreements. At the core of E&B's argument is import substitution creating greater employment. I happen to be in favor of free trade.

Now, to your first point. Yes, we don't get to decide, but through the exercise of free speech and voting we get to influence the people who do decide. This is a point you actually make at the end of your paragraph. And even illegals get to exercise this free speech and perhaps get other people to support their view. This may be legal relatives, friends, employers or officials in towns like Norristown where the illegal population has created a good commercial environment that will be devastated if they suddenly leave.

So, I appreciate your attempt to silence dissenting opinions, but it won't work.